Tweaking my 14900KS + undervolt (Apex Encore)

[Yuvaletzi]

Hey guys first of all my rig is 

14900KS

Apex encore

8400MHz g skil RAM SK Hynix 

rtx 4080 

I want to undervolt my cpu from the bios With ASUS presets and not manual change anything so I tried svid behavior best case scenario then crashed on the finals and even got BSOD for the first time my LLC was lvl 5 then I tried to bump it to lvl 6 then it became much stable. Does this settings safe for my cpu? Btw sync ac/dc to loadline vrm is also enabled should it be keep like that? Before that svid was auto and LLC5 never crashed only temps was pretty ****** high it was like 70-85 now on best case scenario it’s 55-70  What about IA cep any benefits to leave it on? Or should I turn it off? And btw what is this maximus tweak settings mode/lvl 1 or 2? My current is auto 

one more thing my memory is CL40 should I try to do CL38? My cpu sp is 108 overall and mc sp 95

 

 

 

 

[Jonaswox1]

You always want the lowest possible llc for the sake of temperatures. When you are doing extreme overclocks, LLC is used to counter big Vdroop. It is the same as when you have a battery and measure the voltage, it is 12V for example, then when you put a load on the battery the voltage drops ever so slightly. LLC counters this drop. So when you have a high Vcore and high multiplier, you want better control of your Vcore, so you pay with LLC in return for more heat/power. 

As Silent_scone already it also has a big effect on transient voltage variance. To much voltage variance when switching states is a classic reason to crash - which is why extreme overclocks are usually fixed multiplier as to avoid the state transitions. 

[Yuvaletzi]

so if for example I keep svid behavior on best case scenario and put value for ac 0.10 and same for dc 0.10 and LLC4 it will bring any benefits?

right now I check with Hwinfo64 its 0.01 for AC and 0.490 for DC with best case scenario and LLC6 I'm able to run without crashes.

by the way to be able to monitor Vcore I need to enable Asus EC sensors? becaus I can only find core vid and Vcore is not there

[Yuvaletzi]

should I try running maximus tweak with it mode 2 for better performance? it might affect with errors with memtest86?

right now memory gear is set to auto and maximus tweak as well on auto

[Jonaswox1]

Pushing LLC is for extreme overclocking. It is not really meant for daily use, to my knowledge. 

What you want to do is find the "best" SVID behavior that runs without crashing , before touching LLC. LLC is very expensive in terms of heat and power - so you do not wanna compensate for an optimistic SVID behavior with an aggressive LLC. 

In reality its a compromise , as with everything. High LLC can give you a very stable voltage - at the expense of heat (overclocking headroom). Low LLC can give you low heat and lots of OC headroom, at the expense of an unstable voltage (which in turn also kills you ability to overclock). 

So go to extreme in either end and its not just diminishing returns, it outright limits your ability to push the hardware. 

[Yuvaletzi]

ok so what i did reduced AC/DC Both to 0.11 and now LLC level 4 with best case scenario wont crash anymore for me it was only stable with LVL6! now its fine with LVL4 but core voltage while gaming is 1.280V and core vid is 1.350-1380V so it seems I have a more headroom here to push how do I make core vid equal to core voltage? I tried to do more DC than AC and didn't change it I've also noticed that now with the new microcode 0X12B the enhanced c-states now cant be disabled and cause some E-cores to go to 800mHZ during gaming! is that fixable? 
also should I keep my settings like that 0.11mOhm AC/DC ?
btw I was able to boost to 6.2GHZ on two cores but why it asking for more voltages (CoreVID) if actual voltage is 1.280V while I'm gaming The Finals?
and is that ok that I left the SVID behavior on best case scenario instead of Auto or some other setting?

[Jonaswox1]

Also higher LLC => worse transient response. Meaning "unstable voltage during transitions". These spikes can often crash a system that is switching between C states all the time. 

So often High LLC is used with fixed multiplier and fixed voltage  - and not when you wanna run speedstep etc (all the intel energy saving features). So again for daily use, I would not recommend an aggressive LLC. 

[Yuvaletzi]

yep but right now I'm on LLC4 which is right in the middle right?? so it's not aggressive at all.
anyways the purpose is to go lowest LLC available? do you mean to LLC1?
how do I disabled the enhanced c-states that cause couple of my E-cores to went to 800MHZ during gaming?
and my current setting of AC/DC are good? 0.11 for both

[Jonaswox1]

LLC4 is usually fine. 
Yes in theory you want the lowest LLC, but its not that simple, because as mentioned earlier over/undershoot gets worse with lower LLC. 
Transients gets worse with higher LLC which to my knowledge is not a problem when just avoiding transitions ie using fixed core multiplier. But it comes at the price of power draw => heat. 

How to best disable C states I dont know since I dont have the hardware to look myself for this setup. Usually you can either just set a fixed multiplier , or manually disable the c states. Look up the different intel tuning methods names - like speedstep (for using multiple multipliers) and so on, then you can often control the behavior as you want. 

For AC/DC LLC 

"DC_LL needs to match your overall main loadline setting.
This in turn will make your VID match your Vcore and also make your CPU Package power match your VRM Power.
Now the AC_LL you can do whatever you want with, if you want more Vcore or less Vcore then adjust as desired, If you have the DC_LL correct then no matter what you do with the AC_LL the VID and the Vcore will match.

So what I do after I get DC_LL matched to loadline is I just keep dropping the AC_LL until the system is no longer stable making sure to test every situation as you will also be lowering the VID for not only all core workloads but also VIDs when only a few cores are boosting to the max."

Nowadays there are a great amount of videos from really skilled people like der8auer going through most of these concepts. 

[Yuvaletzi]

so if for example right now I'm stable on AC value 0.12 and LLC4 and I did enabled the synch AC/DC to LLC loadline is that OK? or it should be disabled?
as for DC I picked Auto which is 1.0mOhm is that ok? or it's too much? 
As for c-states no matter if I'm disable it or not the enhanced c-states C1E will be forced on because of new intel microcode so I'm stuck with that =/