Asus M/B Offset and Adaptive Voltage mode: Voltage Spikes

[dmt_taran]

I've read tons of threads all over the internet with such a name (or close to it), but I've not found at least suitable answer or solution to this issue (exept for chit chats, "i dunno dude, I was just passing by" sort)

I have 8700K with maximus x hero system. CPU is capable of 4.8 GHz at 1.24V, 4.9 at 1.3, 5.0 at 1.355, 5.1-5.2 over 1.4V, uncore ~4.5GHz at every step, no AVX offset. Every mark, every clock step I've tested gradually last 4 months, and I'm 200% sure it Is stable at those clocks with voltage mentioned. In addition, I've used manual voltage and LLC6 for additional stability, IA lines are set to 0.01.

Target is 5.0GHz
The problem is - I can't get stable OC and voltage while using offset and adaptive. Unlike manual voltage, adaptive and offset makes max load voltage fluctuate at 0.05V range. So either I have unstable OC with 1.312-1.328V constant supply with spikes up to 1.36V, or I have stable OC, but with spikes up to 1.408-1.424V.
The problem becomes more complicated under heavy workloads (e.x. BF1). These spikes get more rapid - I could even say that 50% of time CPU gets more excessive voltage.

However, it's not enough to utilize stable OC with lowered voltage - for e.x., suggesting spikes go 50% of workload time and even more, I could lower voltage below stability point, achieving sweet spot between spikes and undervoltage - but it doesn't work, OC is not stable! :mad:

So what is it about? Why voltage is so unstable while using adaptive and offset? How can I solve this problem? Even if it cannot be fixed while under load, maybe there is some way to decrease these spikes, at least to 0.01V mark?

[dmt_taran]

Carlyle2020 wrote:
Gentlemen are we talking vcore or SVID overshooting?

vcore is actual voltage and tha one should be capped.
SVID ist no voltage at all. It is the signal from the CPU "wanting" the shown voltage. Set by default at the factory.

So if you overshoot SVID it simply means you run the CPU lower than the CPU would give itself on Auto.

...Does that help?

Rgds
Carlyle

No, we're taling about Vcore. I dunno why you suggested SVID. SVID only mentioned in context of offset voltage.

P.S. Nope. cancel my last, that might have been glitch of some sort

[metadist]

Hi Carlyle

Thanks!
May be I have some misunderstanding of how Adaptive mode is supposed to work.

If I have set "Additional turbo mode CPU core coltage" =1.35, ofset=0? I then expect that this is the maximum voltage, that is only applied on max-turbo frequency. And that if CPU goes into a different P-state with reduced frequency, then voltage will be reduced. This is what I see, but On the max turbo frequency I see 1.35+0.5=1.40 V instead of supposed cap of 1.35. I believe @dmt.taran also sees this.
Another confusing part here is word "Additional". May be we just don't understat how Adaptive mode works.

Thanks again,
Artem

[kalle-m]

metadist wrote:
Hi Carlyle

Thanks!
May be I have some misunderstanding of how Adaptive mode is supposed to work.
see 1.35+0.5=1.40 V instead of supposed cap of 1.35. I believe @dmt.taran

1.35+0.5=1.85 not 1.40.. do not put those numbers in lads. +0.05 is what he means

[kalle-m]

hey, turn off "aware adaptive voltage" if you have that on, its crazy. I have the same board, and my "adaptive" voltage setting is 1.000v with -0.100 for a total of 0.900v and hwinfo still reads 1.168 under load which is perfect but that's not what I entered.

but when I had "aware adaptive voltage" on, it didn't matter what voltage I put in, it shot atleast 1.37v whatever setting I had.

so I would suggest you up the switching frequency 50-100khz and check your settings. the vrm on maximus is good enough for 300khz but I run 350, it might be more sensitive with 8700k. I have 8600k.

[dmt_taran]

I think Asus knows about this issue, but can't do nothing about it, and who knows why. There's a raja guy, who intends to be some asus employee, judjing from what I've read. I've asked him through PM as well. No interest or any tip/hint/answer from that guy so far.

[Nate152]

Hi guys !

Adaptive mode does seem to overshoot the Vcore a little more, but you guys got it under control by using the offset in adaptive mode.

Lower levels of LLC can help too, it's best to use LLC to get it close, then use the offset to fine tune.

One thing, the Vcore will not go lower than the VID without using an offset.

Setting SVID to Best Case sets the IA AC/DC Load lines to .01 which helps keep the voltage close to what you set, you can try setting the IA AC/ DC Load Lines manually to .01 to see if this has any effect on keeping the voltage closer to what you're setting. These are found in the bios in CPU Power Management.

Nice going !

[dmt_taran]

Nate152 wrote:
Hi guys !

Adaptive mode does seem to overshoot the Vcore a little more, but you guys got it under control by using the offset in adaptive mode.

Lower levels of LLC can help too, it's best to use LLC to get it close, then use the offset to fine tune.

One thing, the Vcore will not go lower than the VID without using an offset.

Setting SVID to Best Case sets the IA AC/DC Load lines to .01 which helps keep the voltage close to what you set, you can try setting the IA AC/ DC Load Lines manually to .01 to see if this has any effect on keeping the voltage closer to what you're setting. These are found in the bios in CPU Power Management.

Nice going !

Nope. Ofc, offset in adaptive mode helps to decrease spikes to deisred maximum - but then I get unstable system, BSoD, etc. I've already mentioned it - I've tried already playing with offset, so I could get maximum registred voltage at 1.36V. I had to implement -0.05V offset. Thus, my CPU was receiving lowered voltage. But it's gone unstable or got WHEA/BSoD because of lowered voltage BETWEEN these spikes!
However I don't really understand why is it so - from my perspective, CPU still gets those 1.36V time to time.

Because in the scenario, where I use additional turbo voltage = 1.36V + using offset = -0.05V, I still get maximum voltage around 1.36V, but it's not enough for stability.
I even decreased the offset, getting 1.376V-1.392V spikes, but still it seemed like was not enough for complete stability.

And basically, it's more complicated and frustrating at the same time.

P.S. I will try to provide screenshots from HWinfo, in manual and adaptive mode, with and without WHEA errors and voltage visible.

[Nate152]

Ok, are you saying 5.0GHz with 1.36v is stable in manual mode but not adaptive mode?

On the Extreme Tweaker Tab, CPU Power management, try setting:

IA AC Load Line - .01
IA DC Load Line - .01

CPU Adaptive mode - Additional Turbo Mode - 1.36v
Adaptive mode offset = 0 or auto

LLC level 6, it may occasionally overshoot .016v which is normal.

Try this and check the maximum Vcore during a test, 1.376v should be the highest it goes, you can try LLC level 5 if it's stable.

[dmt_taran]

Here are the screenshots (If post is big, sorry, I didn't figured out how to attach spoiler here)

Manual voltage - UEFI + HWInfo




And here.....we have adaptive. See for Yourself what's happening



For skeptics. special:

Nate152 wrote:
Ok, are you saying 5.0GHz with 1.36v is stable in manual mode but not adaptive mode?
On the Extreme Tweaker Tab, CPU Power management, try setting:
IA AC Load Line - .01
IA DC Load Line - .01
CPU Adaptive mode - Additional Turbo Mode - 1.36v
Adaptive mode offset = 0 or auto
LLC level 6, it may occasionally overshoot .016v which is normal.
Try this and check the maximum Vcore during a test, 1.376v should be the highest it goes, you can try LLC level 5 if it's stable.

I've had it set to 0.01 since December, friend. Since I've noticed motherboard was pushing my CPU up to 1.5V at stock 4.3GHz.....

[Nate152]

Thank you for the screenshots.

It looks good in manual mode but is overshooting a good bit in adaptive mode. Setting SVID to Best Case and/or IA AC/DC Load Lines to .01 should keep the voltage close to what you set.

In the cpu adaptive mode, try a negative offset of -0.048v, let LLC to level 6 and see where this puts the maximum voltage. If you're stable with 1.37v in manual mode, you should be stable at 1.37v in adaptive mode.

I see you're running 32GB of 3200MHz 14-14-14-34-1T ram. Try setting the CPU VCCIO voltage and CPU System Agent voltage to 1.15v, these look a little low at 1.00v and 1.10v.

Give her a whirl with the offset and vccio and system agent voltage adjustments and see how she goes.

What is maximum Vcore now ?