[Intel] Sept 2024 (Update on Instability Reports on Intel Core 13th and 14th Gen Desktop Processors

[Silent_Scone]

September 25th Update:

Beta BIOS Links (microcode 0x12B)

Note: Some pages may not have propagated, please check back later

• ROG MAXIMUS Z790 HERO

• ROG MAXIMUS Z790 HERO EVA-02 EDITION

• ROG MAXIMUS Z790 DARK HERO

• ROG MAXIMUS Z790 APEX

• ROG MAXIMUS Z790 APEX ENCORE

• ROG MAXIMUS Z790 FORMULA

• ROG MAXIMUS Z790 EXTREME

• ROG MAXIMUS Z790 HERO BTF

• ROG STRIX Z790-E GAMING WIFI

• ROG STRIX Z790-E GAMING WIFI II

• ROG STRIX Z790-F GAMING WIFI

• ROG STRIX Z790-F GAMING WIFI II

• ROG STRIX Z790-A GAMING WIFI

• ROG STRIX Z790-A GAMING WIFI II

• ROG STRIX Z790-A GAMING WIFI D4

• ROG STRIX Z790-H GAMING WIFI

• ROG STRIX Z790-I GAMING WIFI

• PROART Z790-CREATOR
  
  Z690
  

• ROG MAXIMUS Z690 HERO
• ROG MAXIMUS Z690 HERO EVA EDITION
• ROG MAXIMUS Z690 APEX
• ROG MAXIMUS Z690 FORMULAROG MAXIMUS Z690 EXTREME
• ROG MAXIMUS Z690 EXTREME GLACIAL
• ROG STRIX Z690-I GAMING WIFI
• ROG STRIX Z690-A GAMING WIFI
• ROG STRIX Z690-A GAMING WIFI D4
• ROG STRIX Z690-G GAMING WIFI
• ROG STRIX Z690-F GAMING WIFI
• ROG STRIX Z690-E GAMING WIFI

Z760

• PROART B760-CREATOR
• PROART B760-CREATOR D4
• PROART B760-CREATOR WIFI
  
  Intel Community Forum
  Intel has localized the Vmin Shift Instability issue to a clock tree circuit within the IA core which is particularly vulnerable to reliability aging under elevated voltage and temperature. Intel has observed these conditions can lead to a duty cycle shift of the clocks and observed system instability.  

Intel has identified four (4) operating scenarios that can lead to Vmin shift in affected processors:

1. Motherboard power delivery settings exceeding Intel power guidance. 
   a.  Mitigation: Intel Default Settings recommendations for Intel Core 13th and 14th Gen desktop processors.  
2. eTVB Microcode algorithm which was allowing Intel Core 13th and 14th Gen i9 desktop processors to operate at higher performance states even at high temperatures. 
   a.  Mitigation: microcode 0x125 (June 2024) addresses eTVB algorithm issue.  
3. Microcode SVID algorithm requesting high voltages at a frequency and duration which can cause Vmin shift. 
   a.  Mitigation: microcode 0x129 (August 2024) addresses high voltages requested by the processor.  
4. Microcode and BIOS code requesting elevated core voltages which can cause Vmin shift especially during periods of idle and/or light activity. 
   a.  Mitigation: Intel is releasing microcode 0x12B, which encompasses 0x125 and 0x129 microcode updates, and addresses elevated voltage requests by the processor during idle and/or light activity periods.  

Regarding the 0x12B update, Intel is working with its partners to roll out the relevant BIOS update to the public.

Intel’s internal testing comparing 0x12B microcode to 0x125 microcode – on Intel® Core™ i9-14900K with DDR5 5200MT/s memory1  - indicates performance impact is within run-to-run variation (ie. Cinebench* R23, Speedometer*, WebXPRT4*, Crossmark*). For gaming workloads on Intel® Core™ i9-14900K with DDR5 5600MT/s memory2, performance is also within run-to-run variation (ie. Shadow of the Tomb Raider*, Cyberpunk* 2077, Hitman 3: Dartmoor*, Total War: Warhammer III – Mirrors of Madness*). However, system performance is dependent on configuration and several other factors.

Intel® reaffirms that both Intel® Core™ 13th and 14th Gen mobile processors and future client product families – including the codename Lunar Lake and Arrow Lake families - are unaffected by the Vmin Shift Instability issue. We appreciate our customers’ patience throughout the investigation, as well as our partners’ support in the analysis and relevant mitigations. 

______________________________

August 2024

Hi all,

This update will be pinned here for clarity on the ongoing situation with some 13th and 14th-gen CPUs experiencing instability exhibited at stock.

Intel has issued the following statement (07/22/2024)

Based on extensive analysis of Intel Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors returned to us due to instability issues, we have determined that elevated operating voltage is causing instability issues in some 13th/14th Gen desktop processors. Our analysis of returned processors confirms that the elevated operating voltage is stemming from a microcode algorithm resulting in incorrect voltage requests to the processor.

Intel is delivering a microcode patch which addresses the root cause of exposure to elevated voltages. We are continuing validation to ensure that scenarios of instability reported to Intel regarding its Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors are addressed. Intel is currently targeting mid-August for patch release to partners following full validation.

Intel is committed to making this right with our customers, and we continue asking any customers currently experiencing instability issues on their Intel Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors reach out to Intel Customer Support for further assistance.

https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/July-2024-Update-on-Instability-Reports-on-Intel-Core-13th...

For CPUs that exhibit unstable behaviour

Ensure you're on the latest BIOS for your motherboard

Update your motherboard BIOS to the latest revision containing microcode 0x125. Whilst this ucode revision does not resolve the issue, Intel has clarified that it contains fixes within microcode pertinent to Enhanced Thermal Velocity Boost (ETVB) behaviour that results in unexpected boost behaviour under certain thermal conditions.

Use Intel Base Profiles
The latest BIOS for your motherboard should contain Performance Preference options for Intel Base profiles. Ensure Intel Default Settings is selected. If using a 13th-Gen or 14th Gen i9 processor, choose Profile Performance.
If not selected already, ensure that SVID Behaviour is set to Intel Fail Safe

My CPU is running hotter using Intel Base Profiles than Asus Optimised, is this normal?
Yes, it can be normal for your CPU to run hotter than usual when using Intel base profiles. This occurs because following Intel's guidelines more closely often results in higher core voltages under certain workloads. Previously, motherboard vendors set the Load-Line Calibration (LLC) lower than Intel's recommendations to achieve lower temperatures while still delivering high performance. However, depending on your motherboard adhering to Intel's guidelines can lead to increased voltages whilst operating within Intel's current limits. This can result in higher operating temperatures depending on the workload.

Disable XMP

XMP is considered overclocking. To eliminate overclocking instability XMP should be disabled if experiencing crashing or unstable behaviour. Be sure to retest the behaviour at DRAM defaults.

Evaluate Cooling

Ensure your CPU cooling is working within the expected realms. If still experiencing instability under the conditions described above, consider reapplying the thermal application and removing any third-party CPU contact frames which may impact signal integrity.

Is my CPU damaged?

If still experiencing instability at Optimised Defaults [Intel - Performance / Extreme Profile] with XMP overclocking disabled, you will need to contact Intel.

I've read there was a fabrication issue with oxidisation, Intel has confirmed it.
This issue is unrelated to the ETVB behaviour and firmware and is a physical defect. Currently,  Intel has gone on record to state that a number of 13th-generation CPUs from 2023 are potentially impacted by this issue

ASUS FAQ

[Adrian1983]

This is the most sensible thing to do especially with the newer bios's, I have tried these newer bios' with my usual same settings I have with 2802 on my Z690 which all resulted in worse performance and higher temps and voltages however if users cannot trust or rely on board vendors Auto being Stock as it should be then that is the way to configure and lock down current limits to ensure no silly high voltage at high load across all the cores while keeping power and current at Intel spec.

[Silent_Scone]

See the original post. Intel baseline behaviour results in the loadline running closer to spec as per Intel’s revised recommendations. If you want to maintain the undervolting behaviour you’re more familiar with, you can use ASUS Optimised and revise the ICCMAX and PL limits manually. If you adjust the ACLL(SVID Behaviour) whilst using Intel Default, be sure to check MT performance.

[Adrian1983]

Yes I did this also when I eventually figured out what was going on and why the newer bios was using 1.36v and clocks at 5.7ghz at full heavy load in Cinebench it was then I figured out something wasn't right so locked down the current limit to match my 2802 bios which did result in clocks then dropping down to 5.4ghz there abouts under heavy load as normal however voltage was still 20mv higher for no apparent reason in normal and heavy workloads and the first multithreaded test I ran was Winrar x64 benchmark which consistently showed a performance regress which I never figured out in the end and so reverted back to 2802.

Maybe I will try again after mid august when the newer bios's arrive and go from there.

[dudifergus456]

I agree it seems to me that bios was but together in a haste and not tested properly. I am running a cpu on stock speed no OC,  memory on xmp1 6400 and no stability issues at all (bios 1102). Temps are good   (14700k /strix-E WIF II/ ASUS TUF 4070 (3fan configuration)). I installed the Intel Driver and support program to update the intel drivers automatically and it has updated the network drivers. Maby intel will release their patch through their own update program instead of relying on vendors to do so. Asus has not been a reliable partner regarding RMA and failures to their own products. Last her is a picture of my AI suite 3  

[inge70]

What makes you think it would have been thrown together quickly? Asus only adds the microcode, but doesn't tinker with it. If that were the case, Ibtel wouldn't be needed. Asus is just taking action and wants to make the new microcode available to users quickly enough, which is only possible via the UEFI update, so that it takes effect immediately when booting. If it came via Windows update or drivers, it would take effect after the Windows program and not before, for example if you are in UEFI/BIOS. Windows doesn't write anything to the volatile CPU memory where the microcode is stored. Moreover, Intel has never updated microcode using the Intel Driver and support program tool. That would be news to me. If that were the case, they wouldn't need the motherboard manufacturers. So it usually comes via a UEFI/BIOS update or, if it's really important and also for older CPUs, possibly via Windows Update (that was the case with Spectre and Meltown). Only with Linux can you implement the microcode directly yourself. But that's it.

[Prestonian]

Intel latest statement today (August 9 2024) includes the following

"Intel’s current analysis finds there is a significant increase to the minimum operating voltage (Vmin) across multiple cores on affected processors due to elevated voltages. Elevated voltage events can accumulate over time and contribute to the increase in Vmin for the processor.

The latest microcode update (0x129) will limit voltage requests above 1.55V as a preventative mitigation for processors not experiencing instability symptoms. This latest microcode update will primarily improve operating conditions for K/KF/KS processors. Intel is also confirming, based on extensive validation, all future products will not be affected by this issue.

Intel is continuing to investigate mitigations for scenarios that can result in Vmin shift on potentially impacted Intel Core 13th and 14th Gen desktop processors. Intel will provide updates by end of August. "

The last paragraph seems to be new so this saga may not be entirely over yet and there may be something else towards the end of this month (August 2024).

[swale]

See this link regarding the oxidation issue Intel cooking the Ring Bus on dying 13th and 14th Gen Core CPUs, says leaker

(Intel Foundry Services) can tell you that Raptor Lake was rushed through our Fab in Arizona in record time, but it's also produced in other fabs. However, this location (Arizona) is notable because I can confirm that there was an Oxidation issue by some failure in our HVAC system between March & June 2023. It was so bad that Keyvan Esfarjani had to fly in to make a decision about which wafers (which cost as much as Model X each) needed to be thrown away. To be clear, I don't know what decision was made, but I do know that this event DID happen. And by the way, it affected Sapphire Rapids yields as well, although I doubt it's an issue wasn't fixed by now".

Although the box says my CPU was made in Vietnam, I note this is an assembly plant not a fab plant which is the source of the oxidation problems. See list of Intel plants https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_manufacturing_sites 

This probably means the silicon wafers for my Core i7-13700K CPU could still have been manufactured in the US but then there are many fab plants in the US. Does anyone know the sites where the Core i7-13700K wafers are fabricated?

[Daytrader]

My 13900K says manufactured in IL = Ireland i guess, but final assembly in VN, anyone know where VN is ? thx

[kalo86]

Is there a way to discover the production plant without the CPU's original box?

[swale]

VN = Vietnam