C6H, problems with USB card on PCIEX4_3

[Juanlo_]

TL;DR: PCI Express USB card does not work on bottom PCI Express slot (rated at Gen3 4x on the manual). It works on secondary PCI Express slot, but then video card works at 8x.


I have a Ryzen build with the following components:

- Asus Crosshair VI Hero (BIOS 1403)
- Ryzen 1800X (default speed)
- 32 GB G.Skill DDR4-3200 (at 2133 Mhz)
- Samsung 960 Evo 512 GB (NVME M.2)
- 2 x Samsung 840 Evo 1 TB (RAID 0)
- NVIDIA Titan X Pascal (PCIEX16/X8_1)

Everything is working perfectly (I still haven't tried to clock my RAM at 3200 Mhz, that will come later), but I need a dedicated USB 3.0 card with independent ports for bandwidth consuming USB devices, so I purchased a Startech card with 4 independient USB controllers at 5 Gb/s each:

https://www.startech.com/Cards-Adapters/USB-3.0/Cards/PCI-Express-USB-3-Card-4-Dedicated-Channels-4-...

This card uses a PCI Express 3.0 x4 bus, so I installed it on the bottom PCI express slot, the one named PCIEX4_3. The manual says that plugging a PCI Express 3.0 x4 card disables the three PCI Express x1 slots, and I'm ok with that because I'm not using more expansion cards.

So I plug the card, attach the power connector to it and boot my computer. When Windows 10 starts, I get 4 new USB host controllers, that's correct, but Windows can't start these devices (code 10). They are named "Generic Host USB controller xHCI compatible" and they can't be started. By the way, Windows takes quite a while to load (it was lightning fast before plugging the card). So I try everything I can think of: remove the device from control panel, detect again, disable, enable, reboot... I even downloaded the driver from the card manufacturer, which is older and not meant for Windows 10. When installing that driver the card is recogniced as Renesas USB 3.0, but it still gets the alert icon and the Error Code 10.



So I try to move the card to another slot, and I plug it under the grphics card, into PCIEX8_2, the slot meant for dual video cards, and then Windows boots really fast, as before, and the card is successfully recogniced as Renesas USB 3.0 host controller (4 of them) and it works fine. The problem of using this slot is that my graphics card is reduced to PCI Express x8, so I want the USB card on the other slot. I move devices again, and the problem happens again: card is recogniced as generic USB 3.0 that can't be started by Windows.

I tried to change PCIEX values in BIOS, there is an option to force that slot into x4 mode, but it does not help. The USB card simply doesn't work on the bottom PCI Express slot. As far as I know, this slot only shares bandwidth with the 3 PCIEX 1x slots so it should work fine if there are no more expansion cards.

Is my PCIEX4_3 slot defective? Any ideas? I'm willing to reinstall Windows, but don't know if it may help.

[unknownmiscrean]

Strange it only appears to be renesas controllers. I wonder whether other controllers such as asmedia work? Looking at HWinfo, the onboard asmedia usb 3.1 controller runs at x2 mode off the chipset.

Also seems that the chipset may support 5 PCIe 1x slots... Strange there are only 4 available on the board...

Edit: come to think of it, try disable the asmedia usb 3.1 controller to see if that sorts it.

[unknownmiscrean]

unknownmiscreant wrote:

Also seems that the chipset may support 5 PCIe 1x slots... Strange there are only 4 available on the board...

I realized the stray PCIe lane is likely for the M.2 Wifi slot under the IO cover... silly me...

[Juanlo]

I already tried to disable the usb 3.1 controller, it does not fix anything. The only way I have managed to get the Renesas card working perfectly is by installing it on the second x16 slot, but it makes the video card work at x8.

I'm not a motherboard engineer, but logic says me that if the card works fine on the x16 slot, it should also work on the x4 slot, it's just a x4 card. But there must be some kind of PCI Express enumeration black magic in the background that makes it fail.

[Bill]

Juanlo wrote:
I already tried to disable the usb 3.1 controller, it does not fix anything. The only way I have managed to get the Renesas card working perfectly is by installing it on the second x16 slot, but it makes the video card work at x8.

I'm not a motherboard engineer, but logic says me that if the card works fine on the x16 slot, it should also work on the x4 slot, it's just a x4 card. But there must be some kind of PCI Express enumeration black magic in the background that makes it fail.

Hello Juanlo
Thank you for your inquiry. About this bug , can you help filling out the form in the link below?
I'll pass this to our tech team directly for further investigation and analysis.
https://www.asuswebstorage.com/navigate/s/AC2A57D8A89C45889294CE6F0A8BFC04Y
Please email the completed form to Bill2_Chang@asus.com
Also, please provide any screenshots and photos available that would show this matter.
Thank you for your feedback and have a nice day

[jotakinhan]

The VIA usb 3.0 card i mentioned earlier arrived today. It initially works, but once i detach a device and try to plug it back it no longer gets detected... Works again only after reboot. Also when shutting down the computer windows hangs to the "Shutting down" text and eventually reboots. happens with drivers and no drivers installed. Might be a problem with my other software or front panel though... At least i know Renesas controller does not work with ryzen mobos while VIA controller works.

[unknownmiscrean]

I'm no MB engineer either, but it might be a generic flaw with the x370 chipset. Although I'd say its more likely something to do with the way the C6H handles enumeration. Strange asus haven't fixed it yet.

[unknownmiscrean]

I updated to 1701 last night, and found a PCIe ARI support option in the AMD CBS. The help string is "Enables alternative routing ID interpretation." Not sure if this will help. But I don't have any 2x or 4x cards so have no way of testing it. Its in the NBIO options.

[lightknightrr]

You switched from NEC to VIA? That's a step backwards. VIA is junk (not that they weren't there for AMD in the early days, bless them...but AMD started designing their own chipsets for a reason...).

I'm currently using this card in my machine: https://www.amazon.com/Mailiya-Expansion-Connector-Controller-Internal/dp/B01LZWC7TL/ref=sr_1_1?ie=U...

It's a NEC / Renesas card.

Putting that aside, have you tried updating the firmware on your cards? Station Drivers / Driver Station (whatever it's called) has flash and driver updates for NEC / Renesas cards, even if the OEM hasn't released any.

As to whether the NEC drivers are better than the MS ones...the jury is out on that one.

Also, have you applied the DCOM fix? That might be affecting things.

[jotakinhan]

lightknightrr wrote:
You switched from NEC to VIA? That's a step backwards. VIA is junk (not that they weren't there for AMD in the early days, bless them...but AMD started designing their own chipsets for a reason...).

I'm currently using this card in my machine: https://www.amazon.com/Mailiya-Expansion-Connector-Controller-Internal/dp/B01LZWC7TL/ref=sr_1_1?ie=U...

It's a NEC / Renesas card.

Putting that aside, have you tried updating the firmware on your cards? Station Drivers / Driver Station (whatever it's called) has flash and driver updates for NEC / Renesas cards, even if the OEM hasn't released any.

As to whether the NEC drivers are better than the MS ones...the jury is out on that one.

Also, have you applied the DCOM fix? That might be affecting things.

I have tried everything for the renesas card. Doesn't work if it is not in the 8x slot meant for secondary gpu, and having something in that slot limits gpu to 8x. Renesas card itself is fine (tested in bulldozer system).

I uninstalled ASUS Ai charger and it seems to have fixed problems with the VIA card, for now at least.

[Bill]

Juanlo_ wrote:
TL;DR: PCI Express USB card does not work on bottom PCI Express slot (rated at Gen3 4x on the manual). It works on secondary PCI Express slot, but then video card works at 8x.


I have a Ryzen build with the following components:

- Asus Crosshair VI Hero (BIOS 1403)
- Ryzen 1800X (default speed)
- 32 GB G.Skill DDR4-3200 (at 2133 Mhz)
- Samsung 960 Evo 512 GB (NVME M.2)
- 2 x Samsung 840 Evo 1 TB (RAID 0)
- NVIDIA Titan X Pascal (PCIEX16/X8_1)

Everything is working perfectly (I still haven't tried to clock my RAM at 3200 Mhz, that will come later), but I need a dedicated USB 3.0 card with independent ports for bandwidth consuming USB devices, so I purchased a Startech card with 4 independient USB controllers at 5 Gb/s each:

https://www.startech.com/Cards-Adapters/USB-3.0/Cards/PCI-Express-USB-3-Card-4-Dedicated-Channels-4-...

This card uses a PCI Express 3.0 x4 bus, so I installed it on the bottom PCI express slot, the one named PCIEX4_3. The manual says that plugging a PCI Express 3.0 x4 card disables the three PCI Express x1 slots, and I'm ok with that because I'm not using more expansion cards.

So I plug the card, attach the power connector to it and boot my computer. When Windows 10 starts, I get 4 new USB host controllers, that's correct, but Windows can't start these devices (code 10). They are named "Generic Host USB controller xHCI compatible" and they can't be started. By the way, Windows takes quite a while to load (it was lightning fast before plugging the card). So I try everything I can think of: remove the device from control panel, detect again, disable, enable, reboot... I even downloaded the driver from the card manufacturer, which is older and not meant for Windows 10. When installing that driver the card is recogniced as Renesas USB 3.0, but it still gets the alert icon and the Error Code 10.



So I try to move the card to another slot, and I plug it under the grphics card, into PCIEX8_2, the slot meant for dual video cards, and then Windows boots really fast, as before, and the card is successfully recogniced as Renesas USB 3.0 host controller (4 of them) and it works fine. The problem of using this slot is that my graphics card is reduced to PCI Express x8, so I want the USB card on the other slot. I move devices again, and the problem happens again: card is recogniced as generic USB 3.0 that can't be started by Windows.

I tried to change PCIEX values in BIOS, there is an option to force that slot into x4 mode, but it does not help. The USB card simply doesn't work on the bottom PCI Express slot. As far as I know, this slot only shares bandwidth with the 3 PCIEX 1x slots so it should work fine if there are no more expansion cards.

Is my PCIEX4_3 slot defective? Any ideas? I'm willing to reinstall Windows, but don't know if it may help.

Hello Juanlo_

Our team has confirmed this bug with Summit CPU and has reported this issue to AMD.
Meanwhile, please use the CPU PCIE slot in order to use the USB card.
Thank you for using Asus and have a nice day